Howard Bantam/Villiers 25C

[charlie]

The Howard Gem is worth saving, in working order they are a very capable machine.

[vhgmcbuddy]

Ordered the new parts from Paul at Meetens – what a great service from them. They don’t have the coils in stock right now so am going to try with the old one initially.

Spent the rest of the day cleaning the machine. Looking much better already but does need some paint. I’ll wait to see if it runs first. Totally dismantled the motor/belt adjustment to make it move at all. Working nicely now. Welded a nut onto the turned-down end of the flywheel bolt as well.

There’s no oil anywhere to be found (just some smelly emulsion) so some questions again:

Is the motor bottom end simply lubricated by the blow-back?
What grade oil are you all using in the gearboxes?
Are the little screws for fill level?
What fuel mix are you using? I see mention of 16:1 with 30 weight oil. Is this suitable?

Thanks again,
Jim

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[stuart]

16:1 will be fine with that oil.
Yes the engines bottom end is lubricated by the incoming charge of petrol / oil mix from the carburettor first….then this same mixture goes up the transfer ports into the combustion chamber,lubricating the cylinder,piston etc.
Yes the small screws on the LH side of the machine are oil level screws for the front “worm and wheel” and rear rotor “worm and wheel”.If you have found no oil in these areas then damage (wear) to the bronze worm wheels will be high !!!.These bronze worm wheels are expensive to replace IF you can find them.Also the design of the rotor worm wheel was changed slightly over the years.

[vhgmcbuddy]

Thanks for that Stuart. Lets hope my gears are OK.
What oil do you suggest for the gearboxes?

[vhgmcbuddy]

OK so I’m going to get some non EP SAE140 for the gearboxes.
is normal SAE30 OK for mixing with the petrol or do I need something like this
https://villiersservices.co.uk/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=47_48&products_id=37

[charlie]

An ideal oil would be Castrol Classic XL or Morris Lubricants Golden Film SAE30 classic oil.

[vhgmcbuddy]

Thanks Charlie.

Now I’ve made a booboo and cannot remember which way round I took the piston out 🙁
Can anyone confirm that the lower part of the piston crown faces the exhaust port? I’m guessing that, as it was the side with most carbon on.

Thanks. Jim

[andyfrost]

Yes , that’s correct Jim , be EXTREMELY careful to get the cylinder dead inline before lowering onto the piston (making sure the rings are correctly located in the pegs in the piston) twisting the cylinder to line it up will result in broken rings.

Andy.

[vhgmcbuddy]

Thanks Andy.I am doubly sure I’ve got it correct as if it was 180′ then the ring ends would be passing one of the ports which is unlikely. The head is back on now, with new rings in place. Phew. Bit of a schoolboy error not making a note of the orientation – still that’s what forums and the learning process are all about 🙂

Bad news is, I’m 99% sure the coil is fried. No resistance measure between the contacts, and a dead short between the input wire and ‘earth’ – the latter may be correct but nothing to the centre o/p connector is unlikely.

No-one has a coil in stock at the moment either. Doh!
Anyone got a spare I can borrow? 🙂

How important is the sprung lubricator that’s fixed to the points housing, as mine is missing, as is the points cover.

[andyfrost]

Personally I’ve never regarded the lubricator as being vitally important , but the points cover is , they are readily available.
You would be as well to be patient and wait for a new coil to become available. I’ve been through the topic of testing coils/condensers with a multimeter before , and I’ll say it yet again , they are a waste of time , that is the reason purpose built ignition testers are made.

Andy.

[stuart]

To set the ignition timing Jim first set the points gap to 012″-015″.Then set the piston at TDC.With the flywheel “loose” on the crankshaft turn it until the timing mark on the face of the brass flywheel is in line with the timing mark on the alluminium stator plate.Then carefuuly tighten the flywheel nut up but WITHOUT it turning the crankshaft.The points will then open at the correct advance.

[vhgmcbuddy]

Cheers both.
Paul at Meetens went over timing with me too so that’s sorted.
I’ll wait for a coil, but will probably stick the old one in just to see. You never know.
I’ll get a cover plate and probably a lubricator pad while am at it.

Any views on VilliersService.co.uk vs VilliersParts.co.uk?

Jim

[charlie]

Not used Villiers Service so cannot comment, but I have used Villiers Parts and had good service.

[vhgmcbuddy]

Well its all back together, and still no spark.
Sadly, there don’t appear to be any coils in the country so I’ll just have to wait with baited breath.

Guess I’ll have to get back to grinding paint of the 3-ton tipping trailer 🙁

Thanks for all the advice chaps.
Jim

[vhgmcbuddy]

Well after a bit more tinkering, she’s running.
Lots of miss-firing at the moment as I have an oily mix to bed the new rings in, but I have throttle control, and drive to both the wheels and the tines.

Hooray!

Not managed to start when hot yet – I guess that’s a 2-stroke thing. Any tips?

Also, what oil should be in the bottom of the air filter cup?
Actually, I’ve not got a hose on at the moment which probably isn’t helping the mixture either.

Jim

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